Part 1: Questions You Have Always Wanted to Ask
Tom Shrader tackles audience questions on end times, the rapture, heaven, and challenging marriages with unbelieving spouses. Using 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18, he emphasizes living with hope and readiness for Christ's return rather than speculating about dates. He addresses the reality of heaven, the nature of being baptized with the Holy Spirit, and the difficulty of being married to someone who claims faith but doesn't demonstrate it.
“God deliberately left it vague in terms of the day and the hour and the time and the place, so that you will live as though it's today.”
— Tom Shrader
Series: Questions You Have Always Wanted to Ask
Recorded: October 09, 2003
Duration: 44 min
Themes: hope, rapture, heaven, marriage, faith, readiness, questions, uncertainty, married to unbeliever, questioning faith, new believer, struggling marriage, spouse lacking faith, seeking answers, religious differences, marital conflict
Scripture: 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18, Matthew 24:36, John 20:11, 1 Corinthians 12, Ephesians 4:4, Ephesians 5:18, Psalm 6, 1 Peter 3:1
Theological Themes: eschatology, end times, second coming, rapture theology, biblical prophecy, unequally yoked, holy spirit baptism, spiritual discernment
Full Transcript
So we've had fun with those questions. Let me get at this. There were some interesting questions. If you were not here last week, let me just bring you up to speed quickly. We've invited you to take the time to ask any question you want. I'll be the final judge of whether we deal with it necessarily in here or not.
That's not to say the question's not legitimate. It just may be that it's too technical, and maybe this setting doesn't lend itself to it. Or it may be something that in my judgment just doesn't fit necessarily in here, or even time wise. So what we're trying to do is work our way through some of these questions.
Here's a question, and I'm actually taking a couple of them and putting them together. How does the war in Iraq relate to the Bible and end times? Another one is when will the rapture occur? And then they add to it, before or after the tribulation?
My Journey with End Times Questions
When I hadn't been a Christian terribly long, and this would have been in 1980, end times stuff was pretty hot. Hal Lindsay was at his peak. There was a lot of eschatology, a lot of talk about when Jesus is coming again. For whatever reason, and I don't know if I just didn't get the gene or whatever it is, end times have never been a fascination to me.
That is not to judge those of you who find that absolutely riveting. Obviously, the book of Revelation is in this Bible for a reason. We had been at this just a short time when I came across Matthew 24:36, and it says this: no one knows the day or no one knows the hour.
Well, if no one knows the day and no one knows the hour, then quickly I decided it doesn't make sense for me to try to figure out the day or the hour. So there must be something bigger than knowing the day and the hour.
A Story About Date Setting
I remember talking to Larry about this. By the way, those of you who mark these things on your calendar, it was two years ago last Tuesday that Larry died. I remember talking to Larry about end times stuff, and he was not particularly fascinated by it either.
But there was a time, and I can't even remember what year it was, when there was this pamphlet that came out. I'm making up the date here, but it basically said Jesus is coming back April 17th at 8:27 in the morning. Larry got a hold of this and went through it, and this thing was filled with scripture. It really did capture his imagination. It really was one of those things where we'd go back and forth and he'd say, "Take a look at this."
I said, "Well, I'm not sophisticated enough to tear it apart. I just know this: no one knows the day or the hour. So if I were going to be a betting guy, I wouldn't be betting on April 17th at 8:27." But as the day came closer and closer, there was a little bit of excitement. Certainly Larry got a little excited about it.
So I was talking to the guys in the office about it, and we had some Christians there. It's April 17th, about 8:25 in the morning. I'm sitting at my cube, and the phone rings. I get in this conversation about a deal we're working on, negotiations, things are going back and forth. I'm really intent. I hang up, look at the clock, and it's 8:36. I said, "Well, obviously they were wrong."
We had three or four Christian guys, and they all sat together back in the corner. I looked back, and they were all gone. None of them were there. They were out of there. I called Larry's house, and no one answered. I thought, "Well, what has happened here?" I went back into the coffee room, and they were just in there having a cup of coffee. Sure enough, no rapture.
The Purpose of End Times Teaching
No one knows the day and the hour, but God does tell us that there is this end times. There is this time when Jesus is coming again. Why does He tell us this? Let me just venture what I hope is helpful to you, and that is because He wants you to live as though it were right now.
If you've got your Bibles, open them to 1 Thessalonians chapter 4, and I want you to see just an example of this. Paul is writing to this church at Thessalonica, and this church, like much of the early church, is operating on the assumption that Jesus is coming any day. They fully expected, many of them, to be alive when Jesus came again, and that was raising a whole bunch of questions in the church at Thessalonica.
The question was this: what about all these Christians that have died, and yet Jesus didn't come back? Is Jesus not coming again? What is going to happen?
Paul's Teaching on Death and Hope
Take a look at this, 1 Thessalonians chapter 4, verse 13. Paul said, "Brothers, we do not want you to be uninformed"—it's a negative way of saying we want you to be informed—"about those who are asleep, that you may not grieve as the rest do who have no hope."
That term "asleep" there, he's not talking about what you and I did last night. It's a euphemism for dead. Paul's saying, "I don't want you to be uninformed about those who are dead and what's going to happen to them." He adds an interesting phrase there: "as do the rest who have no hope." There are a lot of people walking around this world who have no hope. They don't know Christ.
About two or three years ago, one of the guys from the church, an older guy, was dying. It was just a long process, and we watched him just kind of slow down. He needed a little oxygen to get around, and then he needed a wheelchair to get around, and then it was just hard for him to get around. During the last bout, he was out at the male hospital, and we'd go out and visit him. Just a great guy, hard-nosed guy, not a guy who wore his emotions on his sleeve.
He was from that generation that some of you are part of, that greatest generation. You told us you loved us because you gave us peanut butter and jelly to eat, and that's enough. I don't mean that critically—I'm saying that's how you express things. I was out there,
and it was clear we were at the end. They told him, when you go to sleep, you are not going to wake up. You go to sleep, this is it. And so when I got there, they said, we've told him that when he goes to sleep, he's not going to wake up.
I walked into the room, and I'm not exaggerating. He literally was beaming. He literally had a smile that went from ear to ear. There was a quietness about him. There was, and it's not an exaggeration to say a glow. I happened to be talking to his son yesterday, and we were talking about it. And he said, you know, I've never been around really people dying. And he said, that moment is etched in my mind. He just had a glow. And the reason is, he was a person who had hope.
Understanding Biblical Hope
Now, let's make sure we understand what hope is. Biblical hope. Biblical hope is not like, I hope the Cubs win the division. What we're saying is, I hope they do, I hope they don't. Statistically, empirical data would not be on our side, but we're playing the Marlins. So there's a shot at this. I hope, I hit a shot, I said, I hope that gets up. I hope that gets on the green. What we're saying is, I hope it will, maybe it will, maybe it won't.
When the Bible speaks of hope in this sense, what it's talking about is something in the future that's certain to happen, and we anticipate it. It's not maybe it will or maybe it won't. See that? So we fix our eyes on Jesus Christ, the hope. And that's important.
This man, interesting enough, I called out the next morning, I said, well, how did when in the night did he die? And he said, he never went to sleep. He stayed up the whole night. And the next morning he went to sleep and literally just within hours just passed away.
The Contrast: Those Without Hope
I've also been around people who don't know Christ, who are laying there and they're petrified. They tend to get a little surly with the people around them and with the staff and with the nurses. And they're afraid. They're afraid because either one of two things. Either A, they don't know what's going to happen, or my contention is deeper. They do know. They do know what they've been.
Here's what they've said. I'm going to just go to heaven by being a good person. And now they're laying there and they're discovering as they play it back in their mind that they haven't been a good person. At least not by God's standards.
Did you ever tell a lie? Ever tell a lie? Ever say I'll be home by 5 and get there at 5:01? Did you ever say I'll call you tomorrow? Did you ever tell a lie? I'm sure you did. If you ever told a lie, you are a liar.
Did you ever steal anything? I don't mean rob a bank. I mean take a paper clip from work and go home. Paper clip that's not yours. Did you? You did. You know what you are? You're a thief. You're a thief without much imagination, frankly. You don't even steal anything big. You steal paper clips. You're a paper clip thief.
Here's what you've done. You've sinned and sin has separated you from God. Paul's making this point is if you don't know Christ, you don't have hope. And Paul says I don't want Christians to be like those who don't have hope. I want you to be okay with this. I want you to understand this.
The Antidote: Knowledge and Faith
So what do you do? What's the antidote to this fear? Well, evidently it's knowledge because he said I don't want you to be uninformed. So if you're informed, now you'll see the hope. For we believe that Jesus Christ died and rose again. That's what makes us Christians. We believe this. Even so, God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Christ.
For this we say to you by the word of the Lord. Paul says this isn't me talking. This isn't my wishful thinking. It's not speculation. This is the Lord speaking that we are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord shall not precede those who have fallen asleep.
Paul said listen, I know you're worried about those who have died. You're thinking we'll be alive. And Paul writes this. And again, we get a sense, and we know Paul didn't make it, we get a sense that Paul assumes he'll be alive when Christ comes. Or some of them will. They lived in anticipation of Christ coming again. And that's by design. God left it that way.
I remember the story of someone asking Martin Luther, if you knew you were going to die tomorrow, what would you do today? And he said, plant a tree. Which sounds like this is a very odd response to me. And so you read the rest of it, and Luther said, if I was a gardener, I'd plant a tree. And what Luther was saying is, I am living today as though I were going to die tomorrow. I think deliberately God has left it vague in terms of the day and the hour and the time and the place, so that you will live as though it's today.
The Great Return
And these people are saying, wait a minute, they're dead. We're alive. What happens? Paul says, here's what's going to happen. The Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, the voice of the archangel, with the trumpet of God, the dead in Christ shall rise first.
Here's what's going to happen. All of a sudden, graves are going to open, urns are going to spit up ashes, the sea is going to give up its dead. All those who are in Christ. What does that mean? To be a Christian, a follower of Christ. Who is that? Someone that believes that Jesus is who He said He was, and plans for their life and death accordingly.
Those that are in Christ, they will go first, and then we who are alive, verse 17, and remain, shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and thus we shall always be with the Lord. I can't even think about this or imagine this. Anything I do comes off like a cheesy cartoon or some sort of a bad film. I can't imagine this happening, but I know this is going to happen, and I'm going to be in one of two groups. I'm either going to be alive, which I would think this would be a hoot, or I'm going to be dead and come blowing out of that tomb.
The Purpose: Comfort
Now, we can get all focused on that. What's the point of giving this information? Verse 18, therefore comfort
Paul says, "I don't want you to be ignorant about death. I don't want you to be ignorant about what happens afterwards." There is a natural curiosity about what happens when you die. It is not morbid. Paul says, "I don't want you to be uninformed about this."
We who are Christians, and those of you who have lost people that you love dearly, you're going to see those people again. Paul's point here is that until that comes, you need to be faithful, fruitful, persevering. Live with the expectation of this. Be prepared. This is certain. This is real. Grab hold of that.
What We Know About the End Times
When somebody talks about end times, and this, and the Twelve Tribes, and all this stuff, I'm afraid I'm not the person that you want to talk to. I'm an interesting person to talk about, but not about that subject. This is not my specialty.
But I do know this: at the very end of that book of Revelation, Jesus says, "Behold, I come quickly." And He's coming again. And the message there is, will you be ready?
Questions About Heaven
There was a question about heaven. How about a series on heaven? Our eternal life after death. Will we recognize anyone? Will those in heaven see those in hell, and vice versa? What are the rewards? What will we do? Will we see this earth? Is Randy Alcorn's perspective correct?
Let me give you a website that is pretty interesting: EPM.org. Eternalperspectiveministry.org. EPM.org. Alcorn has specialized in a variety of things. He has written what I think is the definitive work on the abortion issue: "Pro-life answers to pro-choice questions." It is a magnificent book. If you are at all interested in the abortion issue, that book is mandatory reading.
He is a novelist. He writes novels, I think about every year, year and a half it seems like. In these novels, there is always an interplay between the people on earth and people who are in heaven. And heaven has become this huge fascination for Randy Alcorn. And by the way, I think it should be for you and for me.
The Importance of Heavenly Perspective
We talked not long ago about Romans 8, where Paul says, "All those that I have foreknown, I have predestined. All those I have predestined, I have called. All those I have called, I have justified. And the last part of that is, all that I have justified, I have glorified."
William Wilberforce, several hundred years ago, wrote this: "It's since Christians have largely ceased to think of the other world, that they've become so ineffective in this one." My suspicion, I have no basis for this, but my suspicion is that the Christians in India yearn for heaven much more than the Christians in Paradise Valley. That's a suspicion. I don't know that.
But I mean, why do you want to get out of this? Especially now with the weather changing. This is pretty good. This is pretty nice. I've said it a million times. I've got a great life. I've got a great wife. I've got a great kid. I love the house I'm in. I love my job. I love what I do. This is pretty good.
I'm convinced that to have the proper motivation for life here, you've got to have your eyes on heaven. That whole thing is, "they're so heavenly minded, they're no earthly good." That is a myth. If you're heavenly minded, you will be earthly good.
The problem I see is, we've become so earthly minded, we're no heavenly good. We're treating this like it's home. We've lost perspective of the fact that we're passing through. The Scripture is very clear. We're aliens here. We're foreigners here. This isn't home, and yet we treat it like home. We love it as though it's home. We don't want to leave it.
Randy Alcorn's Perspective on Heaven
What's heaven going to be like? I'll tell you what, for me, and is Randy Alcorn 100% right? 75% right? 50% right? I don't know. I'll tell you what Alcorn does. He just blows the walls out on your view of heaven.
And there's one book in particular. First of all, you've got to be on that website. But there's one book called "In Light of Eternity." Now be careful, because there's a novel that he wrote that's similar to that. You don't want the novel, at least for this discussion. You want the book, non-fiction, "In Light of Eternity." About 140 pages. And he talks about heaven.
Will We Recognize Each Other in Heaven?
Are we going to know each other there? Yes, we are going to know one another there. At the Mount of Transfiguration, there was something very interesting that took place. Jesus appears, right? Jesus appears. Who's with Him? Moses and Elijah.
Now what's interesting is Peter, James, and John recognized Moses and Elijah. How did that happen? Did Elijah have a little name tag? "Hi, I'm Elijah." How did that happen? Did he have a name tag? Is it possible somehow that we're going to have the ability to recognize people in a sense that we don't even know? In other words, is it possible in heaven that I could be moving along, and all of a sudden I'm going to bump into Paul and I'm going to instinctively know that? I don't know, but I know this. We're going to recognize them.
Jesus After the Resurrection
Turn to the Gospel of John for a minute. John chapter 11. There's a scene there. It's the morning of the resurrection. Mary comes to the tomb. John 20:11. "Mary was standing outside the tomb, and she was weeping. She stooped. She looked in. She held two angels. Behold, two angels sitting in white. One at the head, one at the feet where the body was. They said, 'Woman, why are you weeping?' And she said, 'Because they've taken away my Lord, and I don't know where they've laid Him.' And when she said this, she turned around and beheld Jesus standing there, but she didn't know it was Jesus."
Now, we've got some speculation why that might be. I mean, we could just speculate that she was weeping so hard that her eyes were blurred and she just simply saw a figure. She really didn't know. If you go to the account of the road of Emmaus, Jesus
appears to these two guys, and the gospel writer tells us that God had blocked their eyes, so they didn't recognize Him. Ultimately, they saw Him. That's what happens here. She beholds Him. He says, "Woman, why are you weeping?" Supposing Him to be the gardener. Now, how you confuse Jesus with the gardener, I don't know, but she did. "Sir, you've carried Him away. Tell me where you've laid Him, and I'll go and get Him." He said, "Mary." She turned and said, "Rabboni," which means teacher. She fell at His feet, and she began to cling to Him.
Are we going to recognize one another in heaven? I think so. Yeah, I think that's pretty clear we are. We're told there's no marriage, no giving or taking of marriage in heaven. So, apparently there's an absence of that. And yet, obviously, we hear there will be a dwelling place. Will there be private property in heaven? Will there be privacy in heaven?
What Will We Be Like in Heaven?
Here's some things to remember. You will not be an angel. You know, this is not like a bell rings, and now there's another angel. You're not going to all of a sudden become a little fat, round, chunky thing with wings. You're going to be a person in a glorified body.
There seems to be indications from scripture that those in heaven see what's happening on earth, and see hell as well, and vice versa. I don't know. I know this. I think heaven is going to be very different than our stereotypical response, which is, I remember my kids saying, "Dad, going to heaven will be great, but aren't we going to get bored?" That's what they would say. "Aren't we going to get bored just saying holy, holy, holy? And we look down, and it's just 10,000 years ago, and we've got to do this forever? Holy, holy, holy, holy, holy, holy, holy, holy, holy."
You see, I don't think so. I think we're going to be learning. I think we're going to be growing. We're going to be growing in our understanding of Him. He's infinite. We're finite. So if we're finite and glorified, is there the possibility that we can continually learn and yet never exhaust the topic of Him?
We get all sorts of things about heaven. I recommend to you, if you're interested in that, and you should be, at least the website, epm.org, and then the book by Randy Alcorn is really going to be helpful to you because it's really good stuff.
Dealing with an Unbelieving Spouse
Let me ask, here's a question that we have. Is it normal for a Christian to get frustrated (angry) with their spouse, who is supposed to be a Christian, but doesn't typically have Christian values? Church isn't a priority, prayer time. From time to time, our relationship is challenged with stepchildren issues, and my anger is bothersome to me because I know that I should be respectful and loving.
Let me mention a couple of things. When you start to blend the family, I don't care who you are, you've got issues. When you begin to blend the family, I have sat in my office with people that I know who are terrific people, who love one another from two different marriages, love the kids, love the other kids, and I don't care. Inevitably, there is tension in the midst of that. There's difficulty there.
It is probably, I'm just guessing here, more demanding than being a parent of a biological child. There's all sorts of suspicions, there's all sorts of vulnerabilities. "You love them more than you love me, you're not treating me..." I mean, there's all sorts of those things.
Advice for Blended Families
Let me just plead with you, who are a mom and a dad in a blended family, you've got to communicate to one another about this specific issue. You have to talk this thing through. If you happen to be, I doubt there is anyone in here, but if you happen to be somebody who is in the process of perhaps dating someone, meeting with someone, thinking about marrying someone, and you're trying to blend a family together, you have to have open, honest, frank conversation.
I would put it in writing, not as a contract, just to make sure there was no misunderstanding. I can't tell you the number of people that I've been around who said, "No, no, no, no, no, no, I never said, we never said..." A guy marrying a younger gal and she said to him, "Those things aren't important to me." They aren't, until the honeymoon night. Then all of a sudden they become very important. Always? No. Sometimes? Yes. You've got to be talking here.
Are They Really a Christian?
But that's not what this question is about. This question is about, what do I do with somebody who says they're a Christian, in this case they're married to them, but they're not acting like a Christian? Let me give you a couple of things.
First of all, let's deal with the Christian part. If somebody's not acting like a Christian, we need to at least entertain the idea that they aren't. When somebody comes to me and says, "I'm not sure about my faith," I don't give them all the biblical verses that reinforce that once saved, always saved. I ask them, "Why don't you think? What are you curious about? There must be something in your life that has you wondering."
When I talk to somebody and they'll talk about their mom or their dad or their husband or their wife or their friend or whatever, and they'll say, "Are they Christians?" And they'll say, "Well, I think so." Okay, they're not. Because you're going to give them the benefit of the doubt. Giving them the benefit of the doubt, you only got them to "I think so." So we've got to be honest about this. You've got to be honest.
Two Ways to Know if Someone is a Christian
Here you go. How do you know if you're a Christian? Two ways. See, this guy identified the two ways, even though he couldn't articulate it. I couldn't tell by the handwriting if it's a man or a woman. They articulated the two ways you know.
Number one, he's saying, they say they're a Christian. Well, there's a doctrinal test. What is a Christian? It's a person who understands their sin has separated them from God and that Christ died on the cross. Without Christ's death on the cross, there is no salvation. I'm going to talk about it more when I answer this next question.
But let's get that on the table. A Christian believes Jesus is who He said He was. He's not just a good man. He's not just a great prophet. He's not just a moral leader. He's God come in the flesh. And He came for a specific reason.
The angel said to Joseph, "Mary will have a son. You'll name Him Jesus. He'll save His people from their sin." That's why Jesus came to earth. Jesus came to earth to die on the cross because when Jesus died on the cross, He redeemed. He bought back. He paid the price.
You understand that? When I was a little kid, my mom used to collect S&H green stamps. We would collect these S&H green stamps and you'd have to lick them. At first, you kind of thought this was a privilege to lick them. But they used the same glue there that George Costanza used on his invitations to the wedding. It is awful glue. Then S&H company got real smart and they gave you one stamp to cover a whole page.
We would save these and a catalog would come. My mom would look at it and she'd say, "I'm going to get this. I remember one—I'm going to get this hair dryer. This round thing with a long cord and then a bag. I'm going to get a hair dryer. I've got to have seven books. We've got four books. We've got five." When we had seven books, we went to the S&H green stamp redemption center and freed that dryer from that corporate store.
Jesus dies on the cross and He redeems His people. From what? From their sin and from the consequence of their sin. They're freed from that. Do you believe that?
The Doctrinal Test vs. The Moral Test
Well, there's the doctrinal test. I am saved when I pass the doctrinal test. There's no work attached. There's nothing I need to do. There's nothing else required. Nothing else needs to take place. Don't need to go to church. Don't need to have a quiet time. Don't need to pray. None of those things save me. I'm saved by that act.
But now that I'm saved, there's a moral test. My life's going to begin to change. Paul says this. There will be the fruit of the Spirit: love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness, and self-control. There will be a natural desire to be with God's people. You know where they hang out? At church. There's going to be a natural desire to begin to soften. There will be a kinder, gentler you. There will be an internal motivation that takes place. Your heart changes.
So there you go. Now, the question is, "I'm frustrated. Is that natural?" That's exactly natural. The problem here is we need to act supernatural.
Being Married to an Unbeliever
Are you married to an unbeliever? Well, there's so many possibilities here. Let me give you this. What we're talking about here affects people, and there's a sense—and I've watched this in the church, and it's wrong, and it's sin on the part of most people—you'll see a man and a woman. Let's say, because it's often the case, the woman's a Christian, the man's not. And we're very critical of the woman saying, "How could you marry this unbeliever?"
Well, let me give you some examples. Number one, maybe they were both unbelievers when they got married. See, there's an assumption here, because we want to cut ourselves slack, but we're not going to cut anybody else slack. There's an assumption here that they sinned. Now, some people willfully do that. They love this guy. He's a great guy. She's a great gal. Look at her. How could you not love her? And no, she's not a Christian, but if they live with me, I think that'll push them over the edge. And indeed, you have pushed them over the edge, as far away as they can possibly be. There's the possibility that you were converted in the midst of this.
Ladies, if you are married to an unbeliever, what do you do? Well, Peter's very clear in 1 Peter 3, verse 1. You live with him. You love him. You submit to him. You win him, if possible, to Christ with a wordless sermon alone. You don't browbeat him. You don't stick Bible verses in his cereal. You don't manipulate him. You don't withhold sex from him.
Guys, what if you're married to an unbelieving gal? You nurture her. You love her. You treat her as Christ treats the church.
Finding Comfort in Isolation
That's a very difficult position to be in. To be unequally yoked. As you're growing spiritually to be out there, oftentimes it results in great isolation or loneliness. Let me give you the good part of that. That'll turn you to the Lord faster than anything. All of a sudden, you're counting on Him and Him alone to meet your needs. All of a sudden, you're looking to Him to be that spouse. To be that person. And the promise is, He'll never leave you or forsake you.
Listen to this hurt in David's writing: "Heal me, O Lord. My body's in agony. I'm sick at heart. Save me because of Your unfailing love. I am worn out from sobbing every night. Tears drench my bed. My pillow is wet from weeping. My vision is blurred by grief. My eyes are worn out because of all my enemies." Psalm chapter 6.
You're not the only person that's ever felt that way. Where do you turn? You turn to Him and Him alone for that comfort. For that relief.
The Question About Gandhi
Let me give you a couple more. Those are kind of longer answers. "How can you say Gandhi's the nicest man in hell?" Here's the point I'll make. I'll just say, look at Mahatma Gandhi. Great guy. Did a bunch of stuff. Certainly we admire him. But he's the nicest man in hell.
How can I say that? I don't. Gandhi says it. Gandhi says it this way. He says, "I follow the teachings of Jesus. I read the Gospels every day. But I refuse to believe that Jesus or anybody else could die or did die for my sin." Now I ask you. Based on the fact that Jesus is the way, the truth, the life—no one goes to heaven but through Him—and Gandhi says, "I reject Him," where's Gandhi? Unless he changes his mind.
I understand. I don't know the Mahatma and all that stuff. But I'm saying, based on his testimony, at that point, if he didn't change, he's in hell. I'll use the term, "Gandhi's the nicest man in hell."
Understanding Heaven and Hell
In hell, because it makes you think and it makes you uncomfortable. It crystallizes the issue. Heaven is not about being nice. Heaven is about being perfect. And you can't get there.
You already acknowledged it. If you've broken a law, James says, you've broken the law. You're a lawbreaker in God's eyes. Forget what your friends say. Forget at your 50th birthday party when they all come over and say, "Boy, he's a great guy. You know, when I was down and out and my car needed adjustment, he was right there in a jiffy to change the oil." Great mechanic. He'll be the best mechanic in hell. But he's in hell.
We can't get away from this. You can't look at people as man sees them, but as God sees them. How do I know how God sees man? In His Word. What does the Word say? No one is good, no not one. No one is righteous. No one understands. No one seeks God. So I use that.
Just like I will say, Jeffrey Dahmer's in heaven, that blows me away. I was watching some footage the other night on Charlie Manson. This guy, he's just whacked. He's nuts and evil and everything that goes with it. But do you understand this? If Charlie Manson comes to Christ in repentance and faith today, he's in heaven with a mansion perhaps right next to yours. I'd lock my doors, but he'll be in heaven right next to you.
If you're going, "Oh, I can't accept that. Oh, I can't..." Then what you're saying is you don't have a biblical view of God, man, and salvation. You've got to come to grips with that. This is not about what you think is fair. This is about what God says is just. And they're very different things. God sees life differently than you see it.
What Does It Mean to Be Baptized with the Holy Spirit?
Here is a question. What does it mean to be baptized with the Holy Spirit? Have you been baptized with the Holy Spirit? Bibles, if you've got them, open them to 1 Corinthians 12.
The question typically flows from somebody who is either in, around, or familiar with a charismatic or Pentecostal background. The idea of the baptism of the Holy Spirit there, what they're typically referring to is a secondary or subsequent experience to salvation. It is oftentimes viewed as something that happens where someone is speaking in tongues, where someone is having this extraordinary emotional experience. Much like you see in the book of Acts in the second chapter.
So when somebody says to me, "You speak in tongues, do I speak in tongues other than English?" No, I do not. Well, I do, just like they did in Acts chapter 2. So my question will be, "So you have an experience like Acts chapter 2?" "Absolutely." And I said, "What did tongues of fire look like?" "Well, there weren't any tongues of fire." "Oh, then you didn't have an Acts chapter 2 experience."
The tongues that we see in Acts chapter 2 that we're speaking with, those weren't the gibberish that you see on TV. When you turn on TV and you see these guys dancing around, and they're saying "pray to the Lord and this unknowing guru, yada, yada, yada, yada, yada." That's not what Acts chapter 2 was, is it? Acts chapter 2, they were speaking to one another in languages unknown to them but known to the listener.
The Biblical Understanding of Spirit Baptism
What kind of associated to this is the idea of the baptism of the Holy Spirit. So when somebody says to me, "Have you been baptized with the Holy Spirit?" I will say, "Absolutely. I'm a Christian." Because that's what it means.
Here it is. 1 Corinthians chapter 12, Paul's talking about the body. "For even as the body is one, yet many members, all were members of the body, though there are many, they are one in Christ. For we, by one Spirit, we were..." What's the next word? All. Who's been baptized with the Holy Spirit? All who are in Christ. Who's in Christ? Everyone is a Christian. There is no baptism of the Holy Spirit separate from conversion.
Paul makes a similar point in Ephesians chapter 4, verse 4. "There's one body, one Spirit, one hope, one Lord, one faith, one baptism." So when somebody says, "I've been baptized with the Holy Spirit," I'll say, "How do you know that?" And they'll talk about this extraordinary experience. "There was this moment, I can't even describe it." Well, that's funny because Paul does describe it.
Being Filled with the Holy Spirit
Right after Paul talks about the baptism of the Holy Spirit, he talks about being filled with the Holy Spirit. Look what he says in verse 18 of chapter 5. Ephesians 5:18. "Do not get drunk with wine, but be filled with the Holy Spirit."
You ever been drunk with wine? I have. Have you ever operated on the influence of gin and tonic? I did. Three years. Here's what he's saying. "I don't want you drunk." What does that mean? That means being controlled by the booze. "I don't want you being controlled by the alcohol that's in you. I want you to be living under the influence of the Holy Spirit."
What does that mean? One word, guys. Obedient. That's what it means. Right after he talks about being filled with the Holy Spirit, what's he say? "Wives, submit to your husbands." Verse 22. "Husbands, love your wives. Children, obey your parents. Slaves, obey your masters."
If you go to Colossians 3, Paul makes exactly the same point, and he says, you know what you do? "Wives, submit to your husbands. Husbands, love your wives. Children, obey your parents."
What does it mean to be baptized with the Holy Spirit? To be baptized with the Holy Spirit means to live under the influence... First, to be baptized with the Holy Spirit means to be part of the body of Christ. Baptism means identification.
Can You Be a Christian Without Being Baptized?
In fact, there's a question here. Is it possible to be a Christian without being baptized? "I was never baptized, but I consider myself a Christian." Is it possible? Absolutely. Baptism is separate from salvation. If I confess with my mouth, Jesus Lord, believe in my heart, God raised me from the dead, I'm saved.
But what Paul commands over and over again is, now go and be baptized. Why? To be identified with Christ and to be identified with the body. This person, it looks like a lady is writing to me. This person who says, "I consider myself a Christian, but I was never baptized." This person, and the question was, could I be a Christian?
The answer is yes. But you need to understand something. You're absolutely in disobedience. You're absolutely in disobedience to what God said. And I'll tell you in a setting like this, frequently, we will have men and women who come to Christ as adults. They're around it a while. Nobody puts an emphasis on baptism. And now they've been a Christian 10, 15, 20 years. And now they're saying, I'd be embarrassing to go back to the church where I'm teaching a Sunday school class and get baptized.
It's not about embarrassment. It's about obedience. If you're a Christian, you've come to Christ in repentance and faith. And again, how about, "I was baptized as an infant." Congratulations. But that doesn't count. A baptism is subsequent to a profession of faith. Can I be a Christian and not be baptized? Absolutely. But why would you not be baptized? Because it's disobedient.
Preview of Next Week's Topics
There were a whole bunch of them. As I said, I want to deal with the rest of these. Here's one: "How can an Anglican bishop..." and then you can fill in the gap there. And I want to talk about it. It's homosexuality. What about Calvinism? What is Calvinism?
And by far, not even close, the most questions I got were on Catholicism. I mean, it wasn't even close. Here's one: "Can ecumenicalism exist between evangelicals and Catholics? Lay out a clear, concise outline or difference if it exists between Catholics and Christians." There were lots of questions on Catholicism. And so, next week I want to tackle these.
Other questions. If you've got questions, will you write them down on the way out? Just put them on a table there and I'll pick them up. And I hope this is helpful to you. It's helpful, I think. I think it's helpful to give people an outlet to ask these questions. And frequently people who are just even confused about this whole process of church and where does that go have some questions on church. So we'll look at that.
Like I said, we'll either finish up next week or the week after or the week after. As long as the questions are there, I think we'll kind of work our way through them. So I'd anticipate another couple of weeks. And then we'll be done with this.
Looking Ahead to Christianity 101
And the series after this we're going to do is Christianity 101. And I try to give you as much headway as I can on this. If you've got people in your sphere of influence and you want to talk to them about Christianity, without a doubt, the tapes that we send out, by far, we send more Christianity 101s than any other tapes out. And it's a really good, basic, elementary study of the Christian faith and what it means.
We look at doctrine. We look at the Bible. We look at Jesus, the Holy Spirit, the church. It's a great series. So I want you to be thinking about that and thinking about people who you can invite, who are not just Bible junkies, not looking for that, but people who are interested in understanding the Christian faith. Maybe they're little baby Christians who need to grow, or those who don't know Christ.
Let's pray. Father, thank you for this truth. Thank you for these questions. And they're heartfelt and they're serious. And God, I just pray that we answer them in a way that is accurate. If I said anything that is not accurate in line with your word, I pray that somehow you would push delete from each person's memory. God, it's tough stuff. And as we look at really those questions for next week and the following week, they even get more difficult, perhaps even divisive. So, God, we pray for gentle, loving spirits to look at your word in this truth. God, we pray that to you in Jesus' name. Amen. Have a great week. We'll see you next week.